Excellent advice "Sir" Reinman

I know the feeling of telling someone I'm worth $12,000 For your "four" link site. Mr. Harvey

For a good designer (and I'm NOT saying I am one yet) your client is actually paying for YOU to do the job, not just paying you for the JOB.

It ain't always easy making a living from your art/creativety... and we artists do tend to undersell ourselves. We also tend to fear "selling out" and that our other fellow "starving artists" will criticise us if we start making bucks... this happens in all the creative fields: visual arts, music, etc. But I'll tell ya something you already probably know: starving SUCKS and at the end of the day!

is there a higher rate for flash sites????
how much should i charge myself for this kinda work? (unfinished)
http://www.hallcross.co.uk/flash/SplodgeArt.html

P.S. anyone want to buy a nice slow/smooth dropdown menu ???

Splodge,
Give yourself a deal:.
Id say $200

Nice menu by the way:.

Ofcourse a horse more monaey for flash its friign time consuming!!

And it just looks cool:.


Reinman:

I couldnt agree more we totally undersell ourselves.
And yes not every client is a celebrity, and not every client is a fortune 500 company.
So at imes we have to sell ourselves short a bit to get the job.

I make 500 http://www.kennedyclean.com dollar websites all day!!.
Their no where as complex as my 10k sites.

http://www.almaniaudio.biz

But they are a quick buck!

And like you said u need to eat at the end of the day!!

Thats Why with all of my clients i treat them like as if im their "personal web guy" because then they come to me and only me.

I even throw in a few freebies, like free business cards, free flyers here or there even an occasional free poster.

Like you said Reinman you have to show them the VALUE!!
that is so key.
well enough of my ramblings..

bx3800: Well, I did add the option to buy a 10k site from me, but at my current rate, that would be requesting 500 hours of work, or 2 full months of 8 hour/day work! That's a lot of time to spend on a website, especially considering that I typically only have about 4 hours/day to devote to it. I need to up my rate.

I've always hand coded. I learned that way, and it's just easier for me. I do copy & paste a lot, if that's comforting to you. With all the coding that I've done in the past, it's silly to retype something that I've already typed out (image galleries, cms's, etc). I have tried Dreamweaver, but it was a much earlier version. It just didn't write the code the way I like it. Newer versions are probably more up to standards. I should try it out again sometime.

I have made a few flash sites (I actually put them together in SwishMax, but the output is the same)...only one of which is online anymore I think: http://christopheles.designsbychris.com. You don't think it's worth 10k, do you?

digitalpharaoh: Thanks She's 9 months old now, and keeps getting cuter. She actually just had eye surgery a couple days ago...so she looks pretty beat up at the moment! http://amberfaith.chrisandabby.com/

Reinman: Sounds like a plan to me. Only problem is, right now I get hardly any business as it is. I'm not terribly good at marketing, so the right people don't see my website. I've been doing this for over ten years now, but I haven't always had a "business" site. I've mainly just thrown my work on the web and said, "enjoy" not really asking to be hired.

splodge: Looks good! Keep working on it, you've got a great site coming together.

$200 an hour? crap i owe me $1,000 already and i've not even started on the content

You cant just charge by hourly rate either.

Charge as a package deal:.
The majority of my sites run in the 5k range.
I'll do one to two of these a month (good month)
Some lucky ones have garnered 10k plus
And theres tons of mickey mouse one day $500 dollar quickies best for small business, restaurants, mechanics, flower shops, etc etc any small business.

(these are what keep the lights on)

Then you can offer website maintenance and hosting.
I charge 7 of my clients 100-300 per month for just site maintenance, hosting, and upkeep.

Thats my 2 car payments, utilities, and some credit cards.

Any extra income is just for fun.

But also offer more than just web, offer print packages, catalogs, posters, business cards, banners, advertisements.
This is my latest catalog:. http://www.almaniaudio.biz/2007_hires.pdf

These are quick to do and pay good as well:.

Hey Bro, that crazy Canadian is right, but I'll get you a skateboard if you do my website anyway great work on he/she/it, I may hire you in the future, I'm so past due for a site

Paul: That would be great! I might require more than a skateboard for compensation though

its all good reinman thanks for the great advice but what i want to know is what is the best way of attracting clients to your services? i mean does your website really bring in that many people on it's own or do you advertise locally? through contacts? cmon share some more trade secrets

I have to admit I don't advertise. Word of mouth is how I've kept going. At times when I'm about to poop my pants because there seems there is no work, I'll get a couple big jobs and I'll then be complaining about TOO much work!

One big tip is KEEP the FAITH. ACT like you are doing well, and the Universe will most likely conspire to make it SO.

Never act CHEAP, and at the same time respect those that are being cheap. Don't dis them. But you DON'T have to WORK FOR THEM. If you keep saying YES to cheap gigs you'll just put out the VIBE that you are a CHEAP worker.

It isn't easy being an entrepreneur. That's why so many people become cogs in a bigger machine and they work for the Man. Nothing wrong with that.. . in fact you get some sense of security that way. BUT BUT BUT if you just can't stomach working for some dude that doesn't respect your talents, then you gotta try striking out on your own. You gotta be ruthless with yourself and say "I'm Gonn Do It On My Own" and then you gotta be willing to starve a bit... AND keep giving good value in everything you say and do. Eventually, if you don't suck at what you do (and some of you folks will SUCK and some good friends need to tell you that before you waste your life away!) you'll start geting a name for what you do. Then you will start building things up just fine.

It takes a LONG time for most of us to strike out on our own. But the LONGEST JOURNEY begins with ONE SINGLE FOOTSTEP!

Boogy on, my Funky Children!

Very, very well stated, Reindude!

All this talk ask the question.Do you have ANY plans,or consider the option of doing this full time?

My plans as far as this goes is to keep doing it part time/occasionally. It's a hobby. I just love designing and experimenting on the web.

Oh!

Then you can ignore all my rantings! You've made the smarter choice!