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Photoshop Contest Forum Index - General Discussion - non-bashing religious topic - This topic is locked: you cannot edit posts or make replies.

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Marx-Man

Location: The United Kingdom!

Post Sun Jan 14, 2007 7:00 pm   Reply with quote         


Nudge, nudge, giant wink, overtly loud sarcastic whisper they didn't exist... its all a lie... looks over shoulder.. looks back... wink... do you think they noticed all the winking...

Laughing Laughing Laughing




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HandToolUK

Location: London, UK

Post Sun Jan 14, 2007 8:08 pm   Reply with quote         


Paul Von Stetina wrote:
Maybe man does need a Bible, some kind of guideline to show us how we should treat each other, but it was not long ago that the very same people who wrote it, would have burned you at the stake, for suggesting the world was anything other than flat, and that the earth was the center of the universe.


*sigh* Wrong again. I don't know why I bother trying to explain when some people clearly don't want to get it.

Let me try one more time: The "people who wrote" the Bible lived two thousand years and more ago - well before the medieval period and the establishment of the Church as we know it today. It was the latter who introduced the kind of things you're talking about - Inquisitions, Crusades and the like. And the Bible never has taught most of the doctrines that they tried to enforce, as even a cursory glance at one will show you.

That's also why many of the very people illustrated by those whippings and the like, and who were tortured and murdered by the Church, were actually Christians trying to encourage free and open Bible reading and get the Bible into the hands of the common man so he could read it (or at least hear it read) for himself, not have to blindly follow what the Church told them! Try researching John Wycliffe, William Tyndale, John Purvey, The Waldenses, The Lollards... there's a long list.




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"The true work of art is but a shadow of the divine perfection." - Michelangelo
creatrix

Location: USA (but I didn't vote for the shrub.)

Post Sun Jan 14, 2007 8:20 pm   Reply with quote         


Call me a cockeyed optimist if you must, but I think it's plain old stupid to laugh at someone's belief system. If Scion and HandTool believe the Earth is 6k, let them. I don't agree. The things I look to and believe to be fact suggest to me that the Earth is far older. BUT the thing THEY look to and believe to be fact say 6k. This is why I wish we could spend more time looking at the similarities between belief systems rather than the differences. Okay, we have different ideas of how old the Earth is. But we all believe in compassion and in mercy, right? We all believe that we are supposed to care for our surroundings as good stewards of the Earth, and that we shouldn't kill or steal or harm people unnecessarily, right? So why does our species feel so compelled to belittle each other based on dogma?

<<climbs down from soapbox>>

HandTool, of course you are right about the Crusades etc., but what of the stonings of those who worked on the Sabbath? There is no shortage of Biblical accounts of capital punishment for those who disobey the Bible's commandments, so if we can agree that man had a hand in the writing of the Bible, I believe Paul does have a point about those who wrote it being willing to kill in It's name. I'm not sure that this is really much of an argument for or against anything, but worth noting, I think.

Cheers!




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"Every cloud has a silver lining (except for the mushroom shaped ones, which have a lining of Iridium & Strontium 90)."
-Kevin Holmes
HandToolUK

Location: London, UK

Post Sun Jan 14, 2007 8:27 pm   Reply with quote         


creatrix wrote:
...If Scion and HandTool believe the Earth is 6k, let them...


Just for the record, I didn't say I believe the universe and the planet Earth itself is only 6,000 years old. I guess my earlier posts were too long-winded for most people to bother to read them properly... Laughing

But yeah, point taken. We're all reaching the "agree to disagree" point in this debate now... Wink




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"The true work of art is but a shadow of the divine perfection." - Michelangelo
Marx-Man

Location: The United Kingdom!

Post Sun Jan 14, 2007 8:49 pm   Reply with quote         


naw i still disagree... Especially with some of the things i have said... the colour should have been red.... wrong colour ill have to fix it... Shocked Shocked

and As Marx said let thar b red... and it was good.... ghehe i made a funny...

naw i read em...
...ish...


I just think if god exists we should be giving the tooth fairy more credit. Laughing Laughing Laughing




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creatrix

Location: USA (but I didn't vote for the shrub.)

Post Sun Jan 14, 2007 9:52 pm   Reply with quote         


HandToolUK wrote:
creatrix wrote:
...If Scion and HandTool believe the Earth is 6k, let them...


Just for the record, I didn't say I believe the universe and the planet Earth itself is only 6,000 years old. I guess my earlier posts were too long-winded for most people to bother to read them properly... Laughing

But yeah, point taken. We're all reaching the "agree to disagree" point in this debate now... Wink


Embarassed Busted. Laughing

Well, I think the "agree to disagree" point is good... I just hope it doesn't stifle the free flow of ideas. Just because I don't believe in the Bible doesn't mean that it doesn't have things to say that are useful even to non-believers. I like hearing others' spiritual thoughts because I believe that my own path is fluid and ever-changing. I enjoy refining my own beliefs. Smile




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"Every cloud has a silver lining (except for the mushroom shaped ones, which have a lining of Iridium & Strontium 90)."
-Kevin Holmes
Paul Von Stetina

Location: Deep Shit

Post Mon Jan 15, 2007 4:25 am   Reply with quote         


I don't want to come across that I think the bible is bad, or anything like that, man needed some way of keeping a record of important religious events through out history, I'm all for that, there are many important lessons that need to be taught and learned from the bible, but if you know anything about stories, they have a way of changing when different people tell them, add in a mistranslation, or a misinterpretation, and the story changes a little more, add a few thousand years, bad memories, a glass or two of wine, and you end up with something that no longer resembles the original text, now lets get into inaccuracies, exaggerations, different beliefs, opinions, superstitions, fear, etc. and you have what we today call the New Testament
I like most people listened to these stories when I was in Catholic school, I was even an alter boy, wow Shocked And No,... thank GOD, I had no sick priest try anything wacked. However, I was taught to believe that these stories were real, and true, and if you didn't believe, you would go to HELL, so I wanted to believe, but like a cop searching for the truth of something that did not add up, keeping an open mind, and an imagination, I started to notice that many of the stories didn't hold water, as much as you wanted them to, they don't. The biggest problem I have with the bible is the timeframe, now you have politicians wanting to get in the act of making you believe these stories that don't add up, I have nothing against someone that wants to look the other way, and refuse to look at the physical evidence that is all around us, and believe the stories that were told to them when they were children, that is your choice and I can understand if you think you’ll go to hell if you doubt the written word. But know this, a true God that teaches love and peace, will not punish you for using your brain. I'm done, take it or leave it, but this is what I believe. Wink




FootFungas

Location: East Coast!

Post Mon Jan 15, 2007 9:48 am   Reply with quote         


Paul Von Stetina wrote:
I can understand if you think you’ll go to hell if you doubt the written word.

people are gonna go to hell for their sins.
And if you are perfect then you are golden.




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FootFungas

Location: East Coast!

Post Mon Jan 15, 2007 10:14 am   Reply with quote         


the burning couch wrote:
What?......6000 years old? Now your gonna tell me that man was around when dinosaurs were here, of which is (of course)preposterous.

I don't know the earths age 6,000 plus a few (garden of eden) seems right.
but why is that preposterous?
I think that before the flood there where a whole lot of dinousars, after the flood they didn't do too hot.
I think there might be some dinousars living today.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zuiyo_Maru
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mokele-mbembe




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FootFungas

Location: East Coast!

Post Mon Jan 15, 2007 12:53 pm   Reply with quote         


Tombstone Epitaph, April 26, 1890 wrote:

A winged monster, resembling a huge alligator with an extremely elongated tail and an immense pair of wings, was found on the desert between the Whetstone and Huachuca mountains last Sunday by two ranchers who were returning home from the Huachucas.

The creature was evidently greatly exhausted by a long flight and when discovered was able to fly but a short distance at a time.

After the first shock of wild amazement as it passed the two men, who were on horseback and armed with Winchester rifles , regained sufficient courage to pursue the monster and after an exciting chase of several miles succeeded in getting near enough to open fire with their rifles and wounding it.

The creature then turned on the men but owing to its exhausted condition they were able to keep out of its way and after a few well directed shots the monster partly rolled over and remained motionless.

The men cautiously approached, their horses snorting in terror and found that the monster was dead. They then proceeded to make an examination and found that it measured about ninety two feet in length and the greatest diameter was about fifty inches.

The monster had only two feet, these being situated a short distance from where the wings were joined to the body. The head, as near as they could judge was about eight feet long, the jaws being thickly set with strong, sharp teeth.

It’s eyes were as large as a dinner plate and protruded halfway from the head. They had some difficulty in measuring the wings as they were partly folded under the body, but finally got one straightened out sufficiently to obtain a measurement of seventy eight –feet, making the total length from tip to tip about 160 feet.

The wings were composed of a thick and nearly transparent membrane and were devoid of feathers or hair, as was the entire body. The skin of the body was comparatively smooth and easily penetrated by a bullet.

The men cut off a small portion of the tip of one wing and took it home with them. Late last night one of them arrived in this city for supplies and to make the necessary preparations to skin the creature, when the hide will be sent east for examination by the eminent scientists of the day.

The finder returned early this morning accompanied by several prominent men who will endeavor to bring the strange creature back to the city before it is mutilated.


they could be lying, but who knows?

http://www.cryptozoology.com/cryptids/kongamato.php




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Look out behind you!
Marx-Man

Location: The United Kingdom!

Post Mon Jan 15, 2007 2:02 pm   Reply with quote         


FootFungas wrote:
Paul Von Stetina wrote:
I can understand if you think you’ll go to hell if you doubt the written word.

people are gonna go to hell for their sins.
And if you are perfect then you are golden.


Hahahaha... (brem gun)

Query...

Can a person go to a place they know doesn't exist... answer.. no

Can a person go to a place which exists only in belief... answer no...




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Post Mon Jan 15, 2007 2:08 pm   Reply with quote         


Quote:

Can a person go to a place they know doesn't exist... answer.. no

Can a person go to a place which exists only in belief... answer no...

Can a person go to a place wich he believes that he knows it doesn't exist... answer: ...




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Marx-Man

Location: The United Kingdom!

Post Mon Jan 15, 2007 2:30 pm   Reply with quote         


Grefix wrote:

Can a person go to a place wich he believes that he knows it doesn't exist... answer: ...


thats like saying can a person go to a place he belives doesnt exist...
the answer is no.. a prerequisit of travel is knowing your destination. otherwise you go nowhere




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creatrix

Location: USA (but I didn't vote for the shrub.)

Post Mon Jan 15, 2007 3:23 pm   Reply with quote         


Marx, as much as you and I are certain that there is no Heaven or Hell, I don't think we can say this definitively. We can't prove that there is no heaven any more than Scion or Hand Tooled or Foot Fungus could prove that there is one.




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"Every cloud has a silver lining (except for the mushroom shaped ones, which have a lining of Iridium & Strontium 90)."
-Kevin Holmes

Post Mon Jan 15, 2007 3:34 pm   Reply with quote         


Marx-Man wrote:
a prerequisit of travel is knowing your destination. otherwise you go nowhere

ever been abducted or kidnapped...




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